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Transcript
Our transcripts are generated by AI. Please excuse any typos and if you have any specific questions please email info@digitalshelfinstitute.org.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to Unpacking the Digital Shelf APAC Edition, where we explore the unique challenges and opportunities shaping digital commerce across Asia Pacific, with insights from the region's top experts.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Welcome back to Unpacking the Digital Shelf the APAC edition. Today, I'm joined by someone I know very, very well, both personally and professionally. Belinda Grubner spent a decade as CMO at Global Toy Company, Moose Toys, where she built and led teams across six key markets and helped guide the business through a period of rapid global growth and digital transformation. Her career has centered on consumer brands and retail led businesses with a strong focus on building meaningful connections between brands and consumers to drive engagement and long-term growth. Today, Belinda works with founders and leadership teams to shape growth strategy, strengthen brand and marketing capability, and translate ambition into clear, actionable plans. So welcome, Belinda. I am very, very excited to have you here with us on the pod.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
Thanks, Theresa, for having me. It's an absolute huge honor to be part of this podcast.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
And it's hard to believe that we met 13 years ago already. Where has the time gone? When we were together at OfficeWorks making bigger things happen in the marketing department. And for those who don't know, when I say making bigger things happen, that's actually a bit of a pun in the sense that that was our tagline at the time when we were at OfficeWorks. So B, did you like what I did there?
Speaker 1 (01:45):
Very, very clever. It actually blows my mind to think about how quickly that time has gone because
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Potentially
Speaker 1 (01:52):
Even 15 years ago, I think. Oh,
Speaker 2 (01:54):
Is it? Yeah, you're probably right. Crazy. I've stopped counting as I get older. All right. So this is going to be a jam-packed discussion today as there are so many topics I want to unpack with you. But before we jump in, why don't you give us a quick intro into Moose Toys and the role that you held there?
Speaker 1 (02:13):
I'd love to. Moose Toys is a top 10 global toy company founded right here in Australia, and it's really best known for brands like Shopkins and Little Live Pets. And more recently, entertainment-led partnerships such as the Bahem of Bluey and a little known brand called Mr. Beast.
(02:31):
If you have a teenage boy, you'll know who he is. When I joined, the business already had very strong creative and product innovation at its core, but over the 10 years there, it scaled rapidly into global markets, which required very much an agile mindset and strong global to local approach. My role as CMO evolved alongside that growth. It started with probably more of a traditional brand and product marketing remit, but expanded into leading global marketing, very much digital transformation and capability building across all the markets that we entered. A huge part of my role was actually helping the businesses adapt to how kids and parents were discovering, how they were engaging, and how they were purchasing toys as both digital and e-commerce accelerated globally, and evolved our marketing strategy to really reflect that shift in the shopper journey. In some respect with so much growth, you could almost say that I felt like I was starting a new role every two years.
(03:32):
It was one hell of a ride.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Which is really nice and obviously has kept you engaged or kept you engaged at Moose Toys for a decade. And which were the major markets, US, UK, China, Australia?
Speaker 1 (03:49):
We were definitely in China and Vietnam with our manufacturing, but our go- to retail markets were the US and Canada, the UK, France, Germany. Obviously our hometown here in Australia. And just as I was leaving, Spain and Mexico were launching so incredible spread of talent around the world.
Speaker 2 (04:10):
And very different maturity across different markets, emerging markets, established markets. So as I said, jampacked discussion today, you're going to have lots of really great insights and definitely a very, very big 10 years for you at Moose. But of course, your time in the toy industry started over two decades ago. And so you would've seen quite substantial change over that time within the industry. So why don't we unpack that one? Give us a sense of what you've seen over the last couple of decades with respect to disruption as a result of digital.
Speaker 1 (04:46):
100% right, Theresa. The scale of change has actually been quite huge when I step back and look at how that's transitioned, particularly over the toy industry. When I first started, which was in the early 2000s, which is scary number to talk to, it was built on a very traditional manufacturer to retail model. There was also very strong distributor-led model that many toy companies relied on to support global reach, but the path to purchase was fairly linear. You would secure catalog placement, you would ensure key install visibility, you would invest most of your marketing budget into traditional TV advertising, and you would then place a big focus on retailer relationships to really secure that Q4 selling period. Digital disrupted that in a few fundamental ways. Discovery started happening much earlier and in very different places. Kids were discovering toys through content, creators, peers, and they were doing that often before parents were even in the mindset around thinking about purchasing toys for their children.
(05:56):
And I think the real turning point where the disruption became very tangible was the rapid adoption of YouTube by kids. It became a really powerful platform for storytelling and brand advocacy. And at the same time, parents moved from using the catalogs or the circulars that would land in your letterbox to researching online. And we certainly saw in the early days in the US, there would be parents standing in aisle looking at Amazon on their phone to read reviews and then purchasing off shelf. So those disruptions were starting to take place. The other area was the pace also changed significantly. So historically, toys would have a 12-month lifecycle, maybe with a six-month update or change depending on the product itself, but digital shortened it dramatically. There was increased trend cycles and the need to innovate very, very fast. And storytelling became an always on activity rather than something tied to a seasonal launch.
(06:58):
So there was a lot more pressure on marketing teams to have constant freshness of content to entertain kids. And probably the one last thing, the most fundamental shift during those early years of digital adoption was the move from brand-led storytelling where we as the brand owner could control that to consumer-led storytelling. So again, platforms like YouTube gave consumers a voice. Unboxing became a huge trend, not just in toys, but across categories like beauty, tech, footwear. We saw that happening around the same time. And the shift just didn't change the marketing toolkit. I think importantly, it changed and influenced NPD. It created new product categories. It drove constant freshness on shelf, and it even helped reignite sales outside of a traditional Christmas peak. And probably the very last thing would be that for smaller or for newer toy brands, it actually created this level playing field where they could show up creatively without having to have the high cost of long-form content or other more traditional marketing tools that were needed to break through to kids.
(08:14):
So there's a lot there, but the disruption was really, really tangible as you started to get into the 2010s and the role of YouTube and social media came on board.
Speaker 2 (08:29):
Absolutely. And so as you've just outlined, just a little bit of change you could say, and definitely some parallels with industries like travel. I worked in travel in the early 2000s, and what we saw was that disintermediation of the distribution model, the quite traditional distribution model where you had the supplier who sold to the distributor, who sold to the retailer, a lot of parallels with the toy industry and the disruption that you're talking about. But even today, those distributors still play a really critical role and in certain markets, potentially more than others. And so how did the engagement model with distributors have to change as a result of all of the shifts that were occurring in market and are still occurring in market?
Speaker 1 (09:17):
Yeah, I think your point's really valid there because distributors retain not just a critical role current day. I think their understanding of their market, their consumer, their retailers, that's their magic source to remain relevant and also to make sure that they can launch product very successfully in the markets that businesses like Moose don't have a direct to retail relationship. I think the engagement shift though, from my perspective, is it's really taking a keen interest in the digital maturity in each partner's market. Beforehand, it would be like, here's the global strategy, roll it out. It was a plug and play model, but every territory has a different level of digital maturity, different digital shelf requirements, particularly if English is their second language. So there needed to be a heightened flexibility for local teams to have the opportunity to change not only their go- to-market strategy, but what they required for their digital shelf.
(10:25):
So engagement became a lot more complex, not such a bad thing, but digital certainly made it a lot more personalized.
Speaker 2 (10:35):
Yeah, absolutely. And it always comes back to this need and requirement for how do we get those foundations right from a content perspective to be able to best serve our distributors or our retailers in those respective markets. And like you say, you were working across Germany, Spain, you take a country like Germany, obviously that requires German sometimes ... I don't know, is German there's parts of regions that also fluent in other languages, I believe. Yeah. So that creates that layer of complexity that you're talking about when operating in a global organization. So Moose, like others in the industry had to adapt and you've been touching on all the reasons why Moose had to alongside of other major toy manufacturers. So where did the transformation begin at Moose Toys and what were some of the key change and mindset shifts that the organization needed to make?
Speaker 1 (11:38):
I think probably the first point to make was that there was an openness to the change and the evolution, and that's always a huge blessing in any business that you're working, that there is an appetite for it. But the digital adoption within the marketing strategy accelerated quite quickly, and that was very much a benefit to both the brand portfolio and the end customer. Just looking at that marketing toolkit, TV commercials were still an anchor for awareness and reach, but to really build out that fandom and chase, particularly when a lot of the product line was trend-based, collectible brands, it meant that the early adoption of influencer marketing, short-form content became one of the most critical parts of the mix in parallel, and I think this point's really worth stressing given we were running a global team out of the Australian market that digital maturity at that time wasn't the same as other territories like the US and the UK, collaboration with those local markets to understand how their retailers were evolving at a faster pace of trying to see how we could optimize the digital shelf was a huge learning.
(12:52):
So lots of openness to learn, test, and trial, and the marketing team really evolved quite quickly in that respect. I think if you take a step back though, and you look at the broader enterprise digital transformation, that was slower to embed. And that's not a negative thing to say. It's more that any business that has been built on a very traditional model to serve retailers and wasn't born in the day of digital or direct to consumer meant there wasn't really that same urgency, nor was there the foundation to adapt quickly. So in reality, the transformation happened probably more by necessity as shopper behavior shifted and retailers increased their own focus on digital shelf excellence. And what that meant was we had to be really deliberate about where we invested and what we prioritized, how we built capability, and that was probably even more critical because we didn't own the full customer journey.
(13:59):
The direct to consumer component of the business was still in its infancy. So we had to work through distributors and retailers, and it made that partnership and execution absolutely critical to how the organization was able to evolve with the acceleration of digital globally. Probably the biggest mindset shift though was how digital maturity was defined. So it wasn't just about channels or tools, it was around capability, what was the pace of learning within the business. So we had to change how we engaged with distributors, moving towards that deeper, more focused relationship centered on sharing the data, the insights, some of the points I touched on earlier around how were those markets potentially accelerating faster than we were in Australia, or were they slower and how could we help them catch up? So two-pronged approach within the business, marketing was running a lot faster, business enterprise a little bit slower, but the business has done a great job being able to catch up and be able to prove that it is up there with the best these days.
Speaker 2 (15:12):
And I think you've touched on a few really key and important elements that a lot of organizations face when working through transformation. If we think about the impetus or the catalyst to drive the change, you're talking about a very successful organization that has been successful over a long period of time, and that can sometimes be its biggest weakness in the sense of we've been successful, why do we need to change? So I think that's a really important one. Like you said, whilst the organization was successful pre-digital era, by necessity in the end, it had to change and evolve. I think the other really interesting thing that you've touched on is the piece around digital transformation is not just about the channels and the tools. And I think often we can oversimplify it and think if we get the right tools and tech and invest in the tech in particular, then everything else is going to happen as a result of that.
(16:18):
And ultimately, it's the people that drive the change. And so the pace of learning, mindset shifts, the build of capability is more important than the channels and the tools themselves. How do we equip our teams to be effective and successful? And I think you've touched on that really, really beautifully.
Speaker 1 (16:36):
I think the other thing to add to that though, Theresa, is it's also about how as a leader you are building a safe environment for a team that may not naturally have that skillset. To be curious and to know that it's okay to test and trial things and mistakes might happen. If you're going to be agile and you want to be fast, then you have to be able to lead that team to want to evolve and to know that they can do that in a safe environment. So that's a really important part that I think people often forget when it comes to that capability build within teams.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
I agree. I think that you see a number of organizations still thinking, oh, we can bring in a digital expert and everyone else in the organization can keep doing their job as they've done forever. And it creates this divide of knowledge and capability. We have to bring everyone along on the journey and create that safe environment because team members and humans fear change, right? That is a normal response. And so if you're in an environment where change is occurring, naturally you are going to sit back as humans fear change. That is a normal response. And so
(17:55):
If you're in an environment where change is occurring, naturally you are going to sit back and say, "Well, I don't have these skills or expertise. Am I still relevant in this environment?" And so I think you're absolutely bang on as a leader, how do I create that safe environment and even lead from the front and say, "I am still working some of this out. I don't understand some of this, " because that reinforces to everyone that, "Hey, you don't have the answers and we don't expect everyone to have the answers from the get- go." I
Speaker 1 (18:27):
Raised that flag more often than not.
Speaker 2 (18:32):
I love it. So in categories like toys, digital now plays an instrumental role across the shopper journey for parents and children alike with ... And you've touched on the role of content and creators and how critical a role that they play in that shopper journey. How did you think about omnichannel engagement at Moose Toys and what did that mean in terms of evolving beyond a more traditional marketing approach?
Speaker 1 (19:00):
I don't think we originally actually thought of it as an omnichannel experience. I think as we started to evolve what the marketing strategy was, we were able to then give it that label. And I touched on this a little bit earlier, where it probably started was YouTube gave consumers, and particularly the end consumer, the kids of products that Moose was selling, gave them permission to shape the brand narrative and do a lot of that storytelling. But I think what was really interesting was how that influenced the physical experience. And so what I mean by that, the packaging of a lot of the toys that encouraged this unboxing trend, the in- store discovery that became a really important and part of how these kids captured and created content was just as important as the digital touchpoints. So there was this nice flow that was happening offline to online in this sort of flywheel opportunity.
(20:04):
So we started to think of about how packaging could be like a digital asset and not just something that lived on shelf. So that in- store moment, the hunt for the product, the opening it, the telling the story, it fed back into the digital ecosystem through kids and creators sharing those experiences. And most importantly, there was a point of sale innovation too that became a huge draw card to how these kids were capturing content in store to bring also then that digital experience they wanted to share with their fans online. So how you would show up in store, the point of sale material that would get used, even the mechanics of how those point of sale units worked in store to add to that shopper experience became quite critical. The big shift though was putting renewed focus on creating assets that genuinely improved the shopper experience on the digital shelf.
(21:02):
We went very much from put the TV asset up, put the front of back of pack image up. And we realized that we were not actually giving that shopper the best in- depth experience that they could have. So we started thinking quite holistically about every touchpoint a parent might have during their discovery right down to making it really easy on Christmas Day as to how to put batteries in the toy. So for a business that had historically been focused on driving kid demand, this was a really important mindset shift because we had to broaden the lens to really understand the parents' omnichannel journey, which quite frankly had not been part of the consideration before. And then there's two other points that I want to highlight that I think actually do feed into this omnichannel experience, particularly when you start to think about how, and this is a bit of a buzzword these days, but the role of community
(22:01):
And within toys, it does play a really important role. So being part of that community creates a sense of belonging and authenticity that the brands can't easily claim on their own anymore. These digital communities that have been created then spill into real life and do drive people into stores or into environments that allow them to feel like they're part of something in the real world. So that school yard crazes for toys. But in categories like footwear, you've got run clubs for books, you've got book clubs emerging on mass at the moment because of the communities that you're seeing online. So I think the community piece is also building momentum around this flywheel of the omnichannel strategy. And the last piece would be the role of the PR team, which I know is going to sound a little bit left field bringing that team into at all conversation.
Speaker 2 (23:02):
Yes, going to go rapidly as a result of digital. Absolutely. And PR teams think very differently to traditional PR teams, so it makes absolute sense. It
Speaker 1 (23:13):
Used to be about put a press release out. We're launching this product on this date. But in my mind, they're like the culture crew now. They are the teams internally that connect creators, trends and moments in time. And I truly believe that this is a function that's being overlooked for the value it can bring and how it feeds into that creator community flywheel. The most successful teams manage online and offline experience and play that really meaningful role in the discovery and that conversion from what I would call more social commerce opportunities through to traditional in- store shopping. So lots of different things in there as well in terms of that omnichannel experience. But we learned a lot of that on the fly, and then we're really fortunate that we're agile enough that we could start to really hone in on certain areas and improve the capability of the team, but also what we were putting out there to the end consumer.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
And it's probably nice for everyone to know out there who may have, for those that are earlier on in the maturity curve, that on day one, you didn't go out and design an omnichannel shopping experience. There were some foundations you needed to put in place. You were doing a lot of test and learning, and that really helped to inform, well, what does that more mature omnichannel shopper journey that we're building towards, what should that look like over time? So I think there's a lot of really good considerations in there. And how did you think about your own branded site or sites? Where did that sit within the equation? Sometimes I feel like it can be really overlooked by brand manufacturers, particularly because the retailers invest so much within their retail sites and really you're thinking a lot about how you show up in those environments, but we know as a result of AI owned branded sites are becoming increasingly important.
(25:19):
And so Moose didn't have a big D2C presence. So how did you think about the role of owned assets like your website and how did it support that omnichannel experience? It's
Speaker 1 (25:33):
A really good question because I would, and this is myself as the leader of the team speaking here, and the focus I would've put on the website originally was very much, it was almost like a billboard on the side of the road. It was there as a hygiene factor. It had to be there. Weren't selling direct to consumer, so we were ticking a box. However, we did start to see that change. So as Moose started to put the right building blocks in place to build D2C capability, we started to think very deliberately about the role of owned assets in general. And the website did become a much heightened focus because we knew the role that it was playing within the broader omnichannel experience and ecosystem had been overlooked, quite frankly. So we treated the website less as a pure transaction engine and more as that source of truth for the brand and for the broader portfolio.
(26:35):
It did mean that we had to invest in keeping obviously the content current, particularly as the line plan turned over quite frequently. Obviously it had to be accurate and genuinely useful for parents, but the real switch in the thinking was about how we made sure that the right imagery and keywords were flowing through to take advantage of what you mentioned before, whether it be AI or the LLMs that were starting to be able to scrape websites, we knew that it was becoming more important rather. And it was also about ensuring that high quality content could flow through consistently to our retailer pages and support discovery across the digital shelf. So it really had two roles at that point in time. And I certainly know in the time since I've left Moose, the team have accelerated even further than that now. So it's becoming a much, much more important part of the strategy.
Speaker 2 (27:34):
And two audiences effectively. Absolutely. But also the audience of AI engines, and sometimes we can forget that. So I think that's some really useful ways of thinking about role of site and owned assets in a rapidly changing environment as a result of AI. So I'm going to switch gears. Australia has just introduced world-first social media restrictions. And for those in other parts of the globe that may be listening, you may or may not know that Australia is the first country worldwide to disallow kids under the age of 16 years of age to access social media platforms. We are talking Facebook, we're talking Instagram, TikTok, Snapchat, X, YouTube threads, Reddit, Twitch, and the list goes on. And that came into place at the start of January this year. So it is fresh. We know the world is probably watching as it is likely that others will follow suits.
(28:35):
So Belinda, you've obviously worked in youth marketing for a long time within existing guardrails and compliance requirements, but this creates a whole new paradigm shift for the industry that the industry really needs to grapple with. So that was a big kind of context setting exercise now to the question.
(28:58):
It's like a buildup. What do these new changes mean? And what are you personally seeing on the ground locally in the early days of the change and where do you think some of the biggest gray areas are for marketers, platforms, and parents, especially when creators and influencers are such a big part of the toolkit? And some of these are under the age of 16.
Speaker 1 (29:25):
It's a really complex one because from a marketing perspective, the rules probably haven't changed as much as what people think, but the lived experience for families absolutely has. And I would also say to your point around the influencers or content creators that are kids that use those platforms, it has fundamentally changed for them. So taking a little bit of a step back, there's always been guardrails when marketing to kids and compliance with regulations like COPA and GDPR, and they've tightened as digital as accelerated They've probably always been a little bit behind because of how fast digital accelerates, but there are guardrails there to help marketers make sure that they are doing the right thing. So advertising to children under 13 on social platforms has long been prohibited. So brands have had to focus on parent-led messaging, the hope that potentially maybe that parents are sharing that content with their kids or sharing their screens.
(30:27):
And that parent-led messaging was there to help bridge what kids were consuming on platforms like YouTube, where there was a lot more leniency in terms of what you as a brand marketer could do. That said, content creators and influencers were not bound by the same regulations, and they really helped fill that void for the storytelling, the unboxing. And through many years, quite a few years ago now, actually, they became legally bound to make sure that they were sharing that they were being paid or sponsored
(31:00):
To talk about a product just to be able to help kids understand the difference between them posting something that they genuinely loved versus something they were being paid for. But that was how marketers used social and YouTube to reach kids. What changes now is really the scale and the economics. These new laws and the likelihood that other countries will follow, and France has just talked about the fact that they're hoping by their summer break come July, that they will have similar rules rolling out. It's going to make it less attractive for content creators to produce kid-focused content unless their core audience is parents. And I think you could probably argue most of the time it's not. It's probably kids first followed by parents.
(31:49):
So I think in the short term, particularly in Australia, marketers will need to lean into parents more than ever across social channels, which really challenges that traditional drive kid demand mindset that has been such the foundation for the toy business for so long. And maybe there'll be some swing back to more in real life experiences or traditional media, although I'm not really convinced about the latter in this market. From a personal perspective, YouTube is the hardest platform that I can see to navigate with these new rules. It's used in schools. It's shared on family devices. Kids know how to find it on their family TV screen. I have heard though firsthand from many parents of younger kids how these new regulations have given them a huge amount of relief because they can now use the law to say, well, you can't have a TikTok account until you're 16 because that's the law.
(32:51):
But for families with teenagers who had access and have now had it removed, and I can speak to this personally, it's a much tougher transition. You're seeing kids lose a primary form of communication with their peers. They don't generally text or call each other. They use Snap to do that. So if you're seeing inconsistencies with the band rolling out and both the social media companies and I think the government have still got a lot of work to do to find a way to make it more consistent,
(33:23):
It's a huge adjustment for kids and parents alike for those that have experienced it and now had it taken away from them. So there's a lot to unpack there. And I think it's going to be really interesting over the next 12 months to see, has it been effective? And maybe the effectiveness will come into play as more markets actually start to roll it out as well and put the back, I suppose, in the marketer's hand to figure out new ways to engage. It'll be the next evolution of how you reach kids and engage them.
Speaker 2 (33:55):
Yeah, I think you're right. I think it's got a long way to play out where very early days the way that platforms have implemented the change varies. The ability for kids to work around it seems to be quite easy. So if they can find a way, they will. I think you're right in terms of the relief at a parent level, given the pressure in society from their peers, the ability to be able to say no, because it's now illegal to do that, has provided some weight or some tools in the toolkit to parently. But it's interesting as well. I think the interesting thing that we've seen come out of Australia so far is that we've heard some content creators that are under the age of 16, they've thought about moving countries as creators because their kids are making sizable incomes off what they do from a creator perspective on platform.
(34:58):
And it's very clear that some of those are under the age of 16 and therefore they can't necessarily continue what they're doing under the band. So I think it's a really, really interesting one. And again, it's got a long way to run. And so we will see where it ends up alongside of even high court challenges that we're seeing locally as well. So it's definitely an interesting one. And it's nice to see Australia leading the way with respect to this change and for countries to follow. So before we finish up, I want to unpack another topic as I know you will have some very insightful perspectives on it as a parent of teenage children and as a marketer. So we've talked about this role of community, and we're really seeing a renewed pull towards human connection and the opportunity to engage in communities to still have that human connection.
(36:00):
And I feel that that's really being driven by, and I hate to say it, but the loneliness crisis that we're seeing globally that's really seeping into developed countries all over the world. So where do you think this is heading and how should brands be thinking about physical and human connection as part of their omnichannel strategy? I think you've kind of touched on a few things to think about, but I'd like you to expand on it. And with the continual push and adoption of AI and data, what ethical questions do marketers and brand custodians need to get ahead of now, not later?
Speaker 1 (36:35):
It's a complex question in many ways, and I'll probably have as many personal points of view on this as I do industry perspective. But I think in some categories, there's a clear pullback to creating these real life experiences, communities and brand moments that feel human. Some of that's just also driven by the fact that I think a lot of brands realize they've leaned too far into the performance marketing part of the pie and realized that brand loyalty and advocacy come from more human relatable engagement. So that's certainly got a part to play. And I also think it's a response to, quite frankly, digital saturation. You have a lot of people saying they're trying to pull back off it. They realize that how much of it it's consuming of their time and their headspace. So there is definitely going to be, I think, a heightened sense of how communities and not big ones, probably small, very bespoke, will continue to play a role in.
(37:42):
And how brands show up in that will be really interesting. At the same time though, the whole data privacy, ethics and the regulations that are shaping how brands engage with consumers, I think is getting more complex in a lot of ways. So how you balance speed and experimentation and you do that responsibly and you need to be trustworthy as a brand, it's not a nice to have anymore. It's mandatory. Consumers expect you to be very careful with their data, and therefore teams need really strong moral foundations and strong leadership, and also just making sure that you are across these constant evolving data privacy rules that do differ country to country. So if you're a global brand, it's a lot for you to be across. And
Speaker 2 (38:38):
It's not the sexy side, is it, as a marketer? And it's easy to say, well, that's legal and compliance's job. That's what they're there to do. But actually brand reputation is tied to, are we effectively and safely using their data as much as it's the brand that you build and the perception in market? So the role of the marketer is changing. And like you say, the need for them to better understand that alongside of playing their core role is critical. Sorry, off halfway, I feel, but I think it's just an important point for marketers to really step back and reflect on what does this mean for me as a marketer and my knowledge and skillset. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (39:26):
Well, I think also I've always believed very much so that as the marketing person, you are the voice of the customer. You have to lean into this and make sure that you are aware of those changing rules. You have to be the one in the business also protecting them. You have to partner with legal to understand the best way to also protect the business. So there isn't, I think, as I said, it's not a nice to have, it is a mandatory. And I think the future for me, it sits at that intersection of technology and human behavior. It's not one or the other. We can't outrun what's happening in the digital space, and it also makes our life incredibly easy in so many ways. So creating relevance, community, and genuine human connection, it intuitively, to me, feels more important than ever. Certainly not an easy thing to go and do, but I do think there is more of a movement towards it.
(40:25):
And when I think about the toy industry, even though I have obviously moved away from the industry itself, I actually can't think of a better place to experiment and lead responsibly because creating that real world experience for the next generation growing up and doing that with fun things like toys, it's a great place to be able to show how brands can bring that back into part of that brand experience.
Speaker 2 (40:53):
I love that. So before we finish up, just talked about so many things. Any final takeaways you want to share to brands that may not be adapting as fast as the pace of change within the industry, both from a toy category point of view, but even those that are in consumer brands and FMCG more broadly?
Speaker 1 (41:16):
I mean, I'm definitely seeing this across a lot of the different brands and companies I'm working with at the moment. No one's nailing this perfectly, so don't worry about it if you feel that you are behind. There's two things that sort of pop into my mind. One is the first one is probably about curiosity. So ask questions constantly and always look beyond your own category. There's some incredible brands and marketers doing some brilliant work out there, and often they have similar constraints. So being able to reach out, say, I'm really interested in what you're doing, how are you doing it, what are your roadblocks? So the learning piece doesn't come from more budget or more tools. It actually comes from looking outside of potentially the silo that you are working in and seeing what people are doing and how you can maybe adopt it. The second one is about focus.
(42:09):
And I share this because this was certainly a learning curve for myself when digital acceleration was happening and I was trying to do the 500 things on the list as opposed to the five most important. So for me, everyone is on a steep learning curve right now, and you don't need to do everything at once. So pick the one, two, three meaningful things to invest in, be really clear why it matters. I think using tangible examples, for example, show what a competitor's doing and why that's giving them a competitive advantage. And then you can use that to help sell it into your leadership team or with your CEO and CFO, keeping it simple and helping them understand that learning journey too, you're going to be a lot more successful with that than trying to have a long laundry list of to do. And as a mentor has shared with me many, many times, progress builds credibility, so don't ever feel like you've got to get it all perfect at once.
(43:09):
And again, words that I live
Speaker 2 (43:11):
By. I like that progress builds credibility. And just doubling back to a point that you've just mentioned, this idea of looking outside of category I think is so hugely important. We were having this exact conversation with a client just yesterday in terms of what we can learn outside of categories for a big digital shelf program piece that we're working on because often we can become very narrowly focused around what our competition are doing and we end up me too and same, same. And there are a lot of parallels we can take from other industries or where the shopper journey or decision cycle is similar that is outside of our category. So I think that's a really, really important one to reinforce because I think sometimes we can become just very, very category focused and not realize what we can learn outside of what is happening within our industry critical.
(44:04):
Yeah, so that's awesome. Thank you so much, Belinda, for joining us for this episode. I've really, really loved the discussion. I'm so glad that you chose to spend some time chatting to me about all things digital and the toy industry. I think there's some really great insights and takeaways for our audience.
Speaker 1 (44:25):
Absolutely have loved being here and thank you for challenging me with the few tricky questions in there.
Speaker 2 (44:32):
And finally, as always, I want to thank our listeners for tuning into Unpacking the Digital Shelf the APAC Edition with me, Theresa Sperdi.
